The named names thread

Discussion in 'Movies' started by CJ, Nov 1, 2017.

  1. CJ

    CJ Bronze Member Admin Top Poster

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  2. CJ

    CJ Bronze Member Admin Top Poster

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  3. CJ

    CJ Bronze Member Admin Top Poster

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  4. DustinDavis

    DustinDavis Well-Known Member

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  5. nolan

    nolan Member

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  6. nolan

    nolan Member

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    I know this is only for recent cases and you don't have to add this on your list but I would like to remind everyone of Woody Allen because he STILL gets to make movies despite being a pedophile rapist who has raped his adopted child and married his (almost) step-daughter. The second one is morally debatable I guess as she's a consenting adult but man if that's not predatory behaviour. I know that these are old news but I wish these allegations had been treated with the same level of publicity and respect as the Weinstein ones back when they came out.
     
  7. Drew

    Drew Well-Known Member Top Poster

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  8. CJ

    CJ Bronze Member Admin Top Poster

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    • Updated the front post with new names
    • Numbered the list
    • Added a story about LAPD forming a task force, which is a bit rich since they were probably largely responsible for ignoring these claims over the years
    • Didn't add Woody Allen. My logic is, the facts aren't up for dispute. He and Roman Polanski did stuff and people are just OK with it. Its fucked, but its not the same as these accusations IMO.
     
  9. DYohn

    DYohn Bronze Member Donor Top Poster

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    So here's a controversial thought. As much as I deplore sexual harassment and misconduct and as much as I applaud the courage of accusers in coming forward, what ever happened to "innocent until proven guilty" in this country? I really hope that the people who have committed these acts are held accountable, but I don't think it's right for people to lose their jobs because of an accusation. Suspension during the investigation, OK, but anything more than that seems wrong. It reminds me of stories about social services over-reactions to kids claiming their parent beats them because they are pissed about being punished.

    What say you?
     
  10. CJ

    CJ Bronze Member Admin Top Poster

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    Innocent until proven guilty is a legal concept, not a social one. The court of public opinion has NEVER given a shit about facts. From the Salem Witch Trials to today.

    That said, it is especially relevant in these cases where there is often ZERO hard evidence. Often there are no witnesses, no physical evidence (or when there is, there is doubt about consent). False claims ARE made. There is an entire subreddit dedicated to fake hate crimes (e.g. black guy spray pains N-bombs on his own car, Jewish students paint swastikas on campus etc.) and another dedicated to exposing false rape and sexual assault crimes. They're pretty active so it happens a LOT.

    People are frequently dissatisfied with outcomes of cases. Did the Duke lacrosse stripper lie or did the players get off? We'll probably never know what actually happened. I would say LATER evidence points to the fact that she was lying, but that was all after the case was decided.

    As far as companies and other organizations more quickly acting, I truly believe they are in a no win situation. For too long they've waited to see what the outcome is and given what I said about how hard it is to come to anything other than he-said, she-said, they often wait, and then nothing happens and then they move on and there is never any consequences.

    If you are not comfortable with an actor losing work unless they are proven guilty in a court of law, that's what you had the last 50 years. Most of the time these cases are going to fall apart. I went on record of being against payoffs and settlements, but the reality is, that is often the ONLY thing the victim is going to get. The victim knows they were assaulted, the perpetrate knows they did it. But both know they can never prove it in court. So here's your money, shut up.
     
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2017
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  11. DYohn

    DYohn Bronze Member Donor Top Poster

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    Oh, I understand and agree about public opinion. I'm thinking more about companies firing or dismissing or harming the livelihood of people or actors. I'm thinking they might have legal recourse if they are later shown to be innocent. In the public's eyes they are fucked, but that's different.

    They should be suspended or taken off the stage while investigations go on, of course. But I think there is a legal mine field here...
     
  12. DustinDavis

    DustinDavis Well-Known Member

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    Same thought occurred to me as David. I didn’t think it through quite so much. But it occurred to me that some number of these accusations will turn out to be false, or overblown at a minimum (e.g. that actor accidentally touched a boob in a crowded room morphs into something more intentional or invasive). But the cases I have seen so far, there are always multiple parties accusing, making a fraudulent claim far less likely unless there are larger conspiracies among the accusers.
     
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  13. DustinDavis

    DustinDavis Well-Known Member

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    Another example that comes to mind is I saw a clip of Adam Sandler making the rounds because he touched a woman’s knee sitting next to him, during an on-camera interview. Fine, it was unwelcome. Fine, the recipient thought it was inappropriate. But it’s a poor example and I would say using it undermines the argument, and belies the severity, of real cases of sexual assault.
     
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  14. DYohn

    DYohn Bronze Member Donor Top Poster

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    I saw that episode of Graham Norton and there was nothing sexual about it.
     
  15. CJ

    CJ Bronze Member Admin Top Poster

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    Not everyone is having ties cut with them or projects completely halted. It is perhaps reasonable to assume that in the cases where that is happening, the companies in question have direct, absolute knowledge that the accusations are well founded.
     
  16. jasn

    jasn Well-Known Member Donor Top Poster

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  17. CJ

    CJ Bronze Member Admin Top Poster

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    Louis CK came out and said it’s all true and he’s remorseful. Good on him. He claims he never showed his dick to a girl without asking but now understands the power dynamic meant that wasn’t a question for them it was a predicament.
     
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  18. Drew

    Drew Well-Known Member Top Poster

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  19. DYohn

    DYohn Bronze Member Donor Top Poster

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    Oh My.
     
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  20. CJ

    CJ Bronze Member Admin Top Poster

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